Tanya Hale 00:00

Hey there, welcome to Intentional Living with Tanya Hale. This is episode number 256, "Advocating For Yourself." Welcome to your place for finding greater happiness through intentional growth, because we don't just fall into the life of our dreams...we choose to create it. This is Tanya Hale and I'm your host for Intentional Living.

Tanya Hale 00:20

Alright. Hey, welcome to the podcast today. I am super, super excited to have a friend with me today. This is Samantha Nielsen and she is a divorce coach. But Samantha, let me have you introduce yourself. Will you?

Samantha Nielsen 00:36

Hello, hello. Thank you so much. Yes. I'm Samantha Nielsen and I am a certified life and divorce coach. I'm a divorced mother of three and I live in Gilbert, Arizona. And one of the things that I absolutely love about my space is that, you know what? Divorce gives us the opportunity to choose again and make things better than they were before.

Tanya Hale 00:57

I'm a 100% advocate of that. Like my previous marriage was so dysfunctional in so many ways and for a lot of different reasons. It wasn't him, it wasn't me, it was just both of us and a lot of situations going on. And this second time around with the skills that we have, the skills that we teach as life coaches, it's incredible what it creates.

Samantha Nielsen 01:21

I love that for you and I'm so happy that you're happy. It's just a fabulous thing.

Tanya Hale 01:26

Yes. Thank you. I love it for me too, to be honest. All right. So Samantha and I want to talk today about advocating for ourselves. Now there's, both of us work a lot with divorced couples or divorce people, for sure, in advocating for ourselves. But we also, this fits in with us in any situation that we are. If you're married, we still need to advocate for ourselves. If you're single, we need to advocate for ourselves. Wherever we are in life, advocating is important and advocating is something that we weren't necessarily taught how to do as women growing up in the 70s and the 80s.

Samantha Nielsen 02:06

Correct. It is an underdeveloped skill and it's an underutilized skill and yet it's so important to our emotional well-being and the well-being of our relationships. So it's just one of the most powerful things that we can refine for ourselves because it's a blessing to everyone.

Tanya Hale 02:26

Will you expand on that? Like why do you think it's such a blessing? Why do you think it's so vital that we learn how to advocate for ourselves?

Samantha Nielsen 02:34

Well, first let me offer you a definition and this will kind of set the stage as to what advocating is because advocating is different than just making a request, right? If you would like vanilla ice cream over chocolate, that's a request. You may not really care too deeply. But when you advocate for something, there's a lot of passion involved in it. There's a lot of concern associated with it and it's something that you feel very strongly about. So first off, it's important to understand that advocating has a different energy because there's a different motivation behind it. So when we advocate for ourselves, what we're truly trying to accomplish is to own our truth and to be able to give it a voice in a way that we can do so both confidently and collaboratively, because we want to be heard. We want to be heard. So advocating means that you really feel strongly about what you're asking for because it matters. Because it matters and it's gonna have a crucial impact on some aspect of your life or the life and outcome and activities of someone that you love deeply.

Tanya Hale 03:46

Yeah, I love that. In fact, I really appreciate the fact that you said that it matters. Guess what? It may not matter to anybody else, but if it matters to me, it matters. And if it's important to me, it matters. My wants and needs matter in this world as much as anybody else's. And I think sometimes we were socially conditioned to believe that our needs always came last. We take care of these people, then we take care of these people, then we take care of these people. And if there are any scraps left at the end of the dinner, I can pick the meat off the bones. But, what we're saying here is that my seating at the table matters as much as anybody else's. I'm not just there to clean up the scraps afterwards.

Samantha Nielsen 04:33

Absolutely. And we have forgotten this. For women who are probably in the same age range that you and I are in, our middle years, we have forgotten this. We first and foremost, as you mentioned, have been conditioned and socialized to put our needs at the bottom of the list and to believe that that was acceptable. And so we kind of operated within that framework without question, and then we also just forgot. And so once we can kind of have that awakening and that realization that "what, what, my opinion, my voice matters?!" then it's a beautiful thing when we can step into that space and own it from a place of being respectful, authentic, coming from good intention, and doing so because, as you shared, it matters to me. And first and foremost that's the most important thing: it matters to me.

Tanya Hale 05:29

Right. And I think a big piece of this that I love is the space of learning how to live in alignment with what my spirit says is important. And my spirit is gonna tell me that I'm important, because I am. My value in this world is as great as anybody else's value...not greater than, but we're all we're all here together and our values are all the same. And when we one-down ourselves and put ourselves in this place of "I'm not as important as...my needs are not as important as..." we are devaluing something amazing that God has created. And that's us!

Samantha Nielsen 06:10

Yeah, I agree and it's also the biggest form of self-betrayal. And that never feels good.

Tanya Hale 06:16

Right and our self-respect in that case plummets and it makes it really hard to be confident in who we are when we struggle with self-respect. For sure. And hard to create and get the momentum going that we want to get going when we struggle with self-respect.

Samantha Nielsen 06:33

I agree. I agree. So that's, you know, that's the foundational piece of what advocating is and why it is important. And as I mentioned earlier, it's really an underutilized skill and that's because people have a little bit of fear around it. They don't know how to do it and oftentimes they may think that it will lead to conflict, and it absolutely doesn't have to go that direction at all.

Tanya Hale 06:59

Right, and we've talked about here on this podcast about how differences of opinions can lead to either conflict or connection. And advocating for ourselves absolutely can lead to greater connection As as we start standing up and asking for what we want because then there's this space of, again, we're not stepping into the one-up one-down position. We're stepping into an equal partnership, an equal relationship, where both of our needs matter. Okay, so let's talk about advocating in different situations. So I know that, like for me growing up, I don't feel like I had problems advocating. In fact, I remember once when I was about 12, having babysat for somebody and felt like I had not gotten all the money that I needed. I went back to their house the next day and asked for more money.

Samantha Nielsen 07:57

Hey, that's courageous. Good for you!

Tanya Hale 08:00

Isn't that amazing? At 12! When I look back and I think, "ooh, that was pretty brave." But when I got in my marriage, my previous marriage, it was really hard for me to advocate for myself in the way that I wanted to because I felt like it would just blow up into a bigger problem than my just stuffing it down was creating. And I'm not sure that that's true in hindsight. But what are your thoughts on that, Samantha?

Samantha Nielsen 08:29

I love that you've opened the door on this because oftentimes advocating can be situational. We may be strong advocates for our children. We may be strong advocates for our time. And then in other areas of our life, we may not show up at all. For instance, you mentioned within your marriage, you felt like you weren't a strong advocate. And so it's important to recognize that advocating can be a situational experience. and that we have more confidence and less confidence depending on the situation and who's involved. You know, I was a fabulous advocate for my children. I'm a pretty fierce mother and I'm a go-getter and my children are well-accomplished and well-rounded individuals. And I knew how to advocate for them. But I didn't always know how to advocate for myself, as you mentioned, within the marital space. And sometimes I just would acquiesce and relinquish because it felt like it was too much work. And of course, you know, I take full ownership for having made that choice, and in the moment it felt like it was the right choice, but it certainly didn't support creating a stronger bond or creating greater communication and connection with my spouse at the time. So it seemed easy then, but really it had kind of a negative ripple effect.

Tanya Hale 09:57

I see that so much in my experience as well. Like I acquiesced a lot and probably my ex-husband would say, "no you didn't," but I know that I did, right? And I think I stood up sometimes. So I didn't always lay down, but I acquiesced a lot because it just seemed so much easier than dealing with the aftermath. And yet part of the aftermath was, as we talked about before, less self-respect and also this resentment that got hold in my heart and just continued to grow. And every time I would acquiesce, the resentment would grow and grow. And that resentment in my heart just eventually pushed out. It took up all the space for love and it pushed out all the love. And pretty soon I was in this space where all I felt was resentment and frustration in that situation.

Samantha Nielsen 10:57

I want to hit the pause button for just a moment and say, oftentimes one partner or the other will try to advocate for themselves and if they don't feel seen and heard or respected and acknowledged, then I think that's when the trying starts to fade away into the background.

Tanya Hale 11:12

Mm -hmm,

Samantha Nielsen 11:12

And if you're not being heard or seen, you're gonna start implementing protective measures. You're going to protect your heart. You're going to protect your emotions. You're gonna protect yourself in your space. Right? Your personal space. And I know many people, many clients, have shared with me how they tried to advocate and create connection and they desire being equal companions, they desire the equality in the relationship, and they felt demeaned or they felt diminished or they felt that you know, the kind of "less than." Their opinion didn't matter. And so that skill just started to fade further and further away into the background until they were just running on autopilot and doing the bare minimum in order to continue moving forward and doing what was required so that, you know, the family was functioning, basic needs were being met, but there wasn't this sense of partnership and equality. And so when we do fail to advocate, then things get out of balance and it doesn't feel great.

Tanya Hale 12:27

Yeah 100% agree. I saw that a lot in mine. And this is the thing, I don't think it's just in a marital situation where this has to be taking place. I think as women we have been taught to be quiet, to not rock the boat, to be the peacekeepers, you know if you haven't listened to that podcast on peace making and peacekeepers, like so important to understand that we were taught in a lot of ways to be a peacekeeper, which often was interpreted as "acquiesce," like "don't advocate for yourself. Don't ask for things that are going to cause anybody else to have to to change trajectory at all."

Samantha Nielsen 13:06

Yes, can I share a really relevant example here, Tanya?

Tanya Hale 13:10

Absolutely!

Samantha Nielsen 13:11

When I was in my space of divorce, I had a lawyer and I really felt good about this lawyer and it quite frankly it was the second lawyer I hired. I had to fire the first one because he wasn't doing a great job. And as we started working together, I made it very clear that I was an equal partner in this relationship, because while he was the expert in the law, I was the expert in my life and I knew exactly what I needed. I had lived this reality and so there's no way that he could have argued for what I needed without my contribution.

Tanya Hale 13:49

Absolutely.

Samantha Nielsen 13:50

And you know oftentimes as women, if we are working with someone who's in a "higher, more authoritative position" than we are, like a lawyer, we feel that we need to like surrender and let them just make a 100% of the decisions. And that's incorrect. That is incorrect, whether it's someone in a legal space and it's a professional relationship, or a friend, or maybe a religious and faith-based association. We need to be equals in showing up for ourselves because we know what we need. And so it is our responsibility to give voice to our needs, our wants, and our desires so that we can get the best outcome possible.

Tanya Hale 14:36

And I think, yeah, I love all of that. I think it's super important, too, to realize that advocating doesn't mean that we're just going to bulldoze and push until we get our way on everything. Advocating just opens the door for a collaboration. It opens the door of, "okay, this is what you want and need. This is what I want and need. How can we work this together to create something either synergistic or to create just a really great space for both of us so that we can both feel like our wants and needs are valued and are expressed and, and taken into account as we make that decision together," not necessarily that we just say, "this is what I want. Now you make your decision," right? Like, like let's step into a collaborative space, and this could be with our kids, this could be with your lawyer, this could be with, with a spouse, or a boyfriend or girlfriend, I mean, whoever, but learning how to have that voice and say, "listen, mine matter, they're not more important than yours, but they're also not less important than yours."

Samantha Nielsen 15:43

Absolutely. And that's when those elements of acting with integrity and showing up with respect and doing it in the right spirit and with the right energy will help to bridge the gap and really create this terrific space of collaboration and understanding. It's going to create, hopefully, an ideal outcome for both parties. We don't want it necessarily, you know, go heavy on the side of "me, me, me, I have to have it my way or else" because, because that's not reasonable at all, as you mentioned. So it's important to make sure that you kind of clean up your own thoughts and do your own work in advance of having that conversation with that individual.

Tanya Hale 16:28

Yeah. I love that. Okay. So I think we've talked quite a bit about advocating. So advocating means asking for what I want, asking for what I need, but also doing it in a kind way that's also respectful of the other person. Right? Like we're not, we're not going to be demanding because that's not equal. That's not putting us in equal space either. If I'm demanding, that's being demeaning and putting somebody else in a one-down position. And so really learning to address our wants and needs in the space of everybody else's wants and needs being just as valuable and just as important.

Samantha Nielsen 17:08

Yes. I agree completely. That's the perfect framework to use when you are utilizing this skill, when you're moving forward in this space of showing up for yourself. It's the perfect framework for that.

Tanya Hale 17:22

Okay. So tell me what happens when we don't advocate for ourselves?

Samantha Nielsen 17:28

Well, you kind of hinted at this earlier. When we fail to advocate for ourselves, first off, it's a terrific form of self-betrayal. And what I mean by that is we're denying our truth. And so we start to think less of ourselves, but then it also has this kind of negative effect in that we think less of the other. So what we're really doing is projecting blame and we're feeling resentment or disdain or anger towards the other individual, when in reality we didn't show up ourselves and we're feeling upset with ourselves that we didn't do our job. And so those are negative byproducts that we don't want in our relationships. And if we can take accountability and if we can get honest with ourselves and be like, "wow, I didn't ask for what I needed and now I'm feeling kind of upset about that," then we can course correct. And so it's really important to recognize, you know what, if they don't know what you want they can't make the change. You didn't even give them the opportunity. And so why not open that door and see how they'll respond, give them the opportunity and see what could be rather than just making assumptions.

Tanya Hale 18:44

Right. Oh, gosh, I love that. That totally reminds me of this space of conflict where the way that I've taught it here on the podcast before is that conflict is just a neutral circumstance. It's two people having two different opinions. My wants and needs, your wants and needs. And yet we can turn that into conflict. Wait, contention, sorry. We can turn that into contention by saying "my wants and needs are more important." And both of us fighting that space or we can turn it into connection where we say, "listen, we both have wants and needs. What can we do here?" And I love this piece that you said that if I don't advocate for myself, not only do I see myself as lesser, but then I start seeing the other person as lesser as well, because then I'm like, "well, they're not even paying attention to me. They're heavy handed. They're..." whatever, like I'll start calling names. And then I see both of us in a more negative light. But if I am willing to advocate for myself and put my wants and needs out there, then I feel more self-respect and more self-love, as well as it gives the other person a chance to show up in a space that's respectful of my wants and needs. And then I feel more positive toward them. So not advocating for myself leads to more negative feelings toward me and the other person. Advocating for myself brings more positive toward me and the other person.

Samantha Nielsen 20:11

Absolutely. It increases feelings of self-respect, high quality self-esteem, it increases feelings of self-worth. And when you feel that way about yourself, you're going to feel that way about others. Now even if you make that request through advocating and it doesn't work out the way that you had hoped, you can still put your head on the pillow at the end of the day and be like, "I showed up for myself. I did my job and I'm proud of myself."

Tanya Hale 20:37

Right. And if you're in a tenuous relationship that's kind of struggling and you advocate for yourself in a really respectful, loving way toward the other person, and they are demeaning or something like that, as we've said before, that's good data. That is really good information to let me know. How does this person want to show up in this relationship? How are they showing up in this relationship? And it doesn't mean that the one time of somebody like dismissing what you want and need means that it's the end of a relationship for sure. But when we continue to see that same data point show up time and time and time again, it lets us know, "oh, like this is how they're showing up every time." That's data. What do I want to do with that data now that I have it?

Samantha Nielsen 21:28

And that's the real valuable question. What do I want to do now that I have the feedback? Now that I can see this as a pattern, how do I want to feel about this and what do I want to do? And from there, you can make a choice that will serve your greatest good and it doesn't have to be emotionally loaded. It doesn't have to be filled with anger. It can simply be, "hmm, this is interesting. Now I get to make a decision."

Tanya Hale 21:55

Yeah, love it. Okay, so let's give some examples of what advocating would look like and what it would sound like. Do you want to go first?

Samantha Nielsen 22:04

Sure, you bet. I have one that I think everyone can relate to. It was a situational thing that had come up regarding a car purchase. So, you know, let's leave the relationships on the sidelines for just a moment and I'll use something that's very simple and relatable. I purchased a car about a year and a half ago and I purchased it from North Carolina and I live in Arizona. Well, in the middle of these negotiations and working out the details, they had agreed that they would ship the car to me by a certain date. I took them for their word. I believed it was going to happen. I sold the family minivan.

Tanya Hale 22:39

Darn it, you got rid of the minivan?

Samantha Nielsen 22:39

Oh, I got rid of that mom car.

Tanya Hale 22:39

I loved my minivan back in the day.

Samantha Nielsen 22:51

I did too and it served me well. But you know, I'm in a new chapter of my life. I had sold the car knowing that this new car was gonna arrive on this agreed upon date. Well, sure enough, they're behind schedule. And the sales rep lets me know that they're three days behind, the new car's not gonna arrive when I had anticipated. I'm a single mom. And I have things to do and commitments. And I was a little bit agitated by this. And I thought, "hmm, this is a problem." So recognizing that there was something that needed to be reconciled, I first and foremost identified what I wanted, what I needed and what the problem was. And then I also created and recognized what a possible solution was and why it was important. I reached out to the sales rep and I just said, "hey, here's the deal. I don't have a car now for three days and that's not going to work for me. I have commitments, I have children. I need a vehicle. I would like you to please provide me with a rental for the three days so that I am not stuck at my house and handicapped for this period of time until the car comes. And I'd like you to do that please." They were so agreeable. They were so happy to do that for me. He had no idea that I had already sold the minivan. How could he possibly know that? He didn't. So I had to show up and ask for what I needed, tell him why, and do it with some confidence and from a position of being respectful and collaborative. And it was an easy answer. It was an easy "yes" and both parties were happy.

Tanya Hale 24:28

Okay, so here's what I love about what you did there. First of all, you were clear on what? What was the problem? What was the solution? So and then you talked about your why. Why do I need this resolve? Why is this important to me? And then you communicated confidently. There's a lot of C's in there, right? Like you put your, how did you do it? You went in and you just said, "listen, this is what needs to happen for this to be resolved correctly." I love that.

Samantha Nielsen 24:55

And I actually identify this as the three C's when I'm working with my clients and I have some material on that. It is, you know, you need to have clarity in what needs to happen and what the problem is and the solution. Don't forget the solution. So clarity with the problem and solution. Your cause. That's the second C. You need to understand why you're doing it, right? Why it's important and stay with the matter at hand. Don't intermingle issues and then you need to communicate with confidence, which means you actually have to open your mouth and articulate the words and make the request.

Tanya Hale 25:29

Right. Which is super, super scary. I know when I first started doing this, I was terrified to ask for what I want, especially probably more so in the context of a relationship. When I first started dating and realized that I needed to start asking for what I wanted and I needed to be able to to say no to a second date request when I knew it wasn't a good fit. And I needed to be able to you know, ask. I mean, I remember the first time I was dating my first 90-day guy. And I wanted to ask him for a shoulder rub because we, we'd gone somewhere and I was just, my shoulders were so tight and I was terrified. Isn't that just silly? It took me about 10 minutes to get up the courage to ask because I was so afraid of rejection.

Samantha Nielsen 26:24

How did it unfold when you did?

Tanya Hale 26:25

I asked him and he was like, "Oh, absolutely." And he immediately just reached over and started, and I was like, "Whoa, like people do that. Like that happens." And, you know, and I found though that asking for what I want is super important. And, you know, and had he said, "No, I don't do shoulder rubs." That would have been good data, not necessarily a deal breaker, but it would have been good data, good to know that he's not in that realm. But learning to ask for what I want has been super scary. So I suggest that we just start off by asking little small things that don't have as much at stake.

Tanya Hale 27:06

So for example, one of my clients this week is working through this exact same thing. And I suggested to her, and she's loving that she gets to tell her husband that my life coach said I need to go get a massage.

Samantha Nielsen 27:19

That's fabulous. I love that too.

Tanya Hale 27:21

Because in a massage, we were talking about it, she says, if they're doing it too hard or too soft, I never say anything. If I want more time on my lower back, I never say anything. I'm like, "okay, this is your chance." You are paying this person to provide a service for you. They want you to ask for what you want because they want you to walk away happy with your massage. They want you to say, "oh, a little bit more time right there on my shoulders, please. Right there by that right shoulder blade, will you get, oh yeah, right there that spot. Will you just work that out?" They want us to say we want it softer or we want a deeper tissue massage. And so I think by learning to start off by little small things like that, I think it really helps us to learn how to start finding our voice and finding that, "oh, I can ask for what I want and the world does not come crashing down."

Samantha Nielsen 28:14

Correct. And I love that you identified: grow into this through small steps. Grow into this by taking small proactive steps that will support you in building your skills and your confidence. What a great exercise for your client because that massage therapist does want to provide a good experience. And they can't do that if they're not being encouraged and coached and told what you need as a client, right? So we can create positive experiences where we refine this skill by doing it in small, incremental steps as you suggested with this client and her massage.

Tanya Hale 28:57

Well, and as we look at our bigger, more important relationships as well, like in my marriage relationship, I love it when my husband lets me know something that he wants because I'm like, "oh, of course I want to do that for you. If I can, I absolutely want to do that." I want opportunities to do things for him, but I don't know to do those unless he asks, but it works on the other side as well. He wants to do nice, lovely things for me, but he can't do it if he doesn't know what I want. And so learning to ask for what I want and realize that it doesn't make me needy, it makes me a human. Right?

Samantha Nielsen 29:43

And I'm going out most people want to accommodate, if they can. I would say, you know, nine times out of 10, if the person can meet that need and it's a healthy, respectful, collaborative request, they're going to try and show up and do their best because I think as people, we want to love and support and work in cooperation with one another. So, first and foremost, I want to recognize that most people want to show up in that space. And so if they can, they will. And then the second thing I want to also offer to both, you and I and our listeners, is you didn't have that request met prior, so it was already a "no" because you have not already asked for it. So you've already lost nothing. It was already a "no." But if you ask for it and then you're met with a "no," at least you went through the process of advocating for yourself and you could feel good about that rather than short changing yourself in advance. Does that make sense?

Tanya Hale 30:41

Oh, absolutely. I'm just going to share one last experience where I recently just got a "no." So my husband is a runner and he was running the, it's called the Indy Mini, last weekend, which is a half marathon. And I had been there at the start of the race and then I took an Uber down to the middle of the race so that I could see him at one of the midpoints. And the whole town downtown was shut down for this marathon. And I called an Uber to take me back to the finish line and no Uber. They couldn't get through because because the roads were all closed and this Uber tried and I watched him and he even called me and about 20 minutes later, he just canceled. And I was like, "oh, like I've been standing here for 20 minutes." And I saw this lady across the street coming back with signs. You know, so I knew that they had been and she had a couple of smaller kids with her and I thought, "I'm just going to go ask. I'm going to go ask if she's going to the end of the race and if I could ride with her." And I was super nervous because this is not my thing. I don't usually do that, especially somebody strange. I know that a mom with kids is going to be a little protective. But I was like, "listen, I'm a nice person. I'm gonna ask." And so I went up and I just said, "listen, I have a favor to ask and I, you know, are you, if you're headed to the end of the race to see that, I would really appreciate it if I could get a ride, my Uber just quit," and she started hemming and hawing and was like, "oh well, I don't know if I'm gonna go to the end of the race." I'm like, that's okay. I said, "it's okay to say no. I said, I know that it's strange and it's awkward to have a stranger come up and ask for a ride, especially when you have little kids. So I know that's strange, but I just wanted to ask because I can't get an Uber. I can't get a ride back to the end of the race." And again, she was really uncomfortable saying "no." And I thought for one, I was, and I let her know. I said, "listen, it's 100% okay to say no. Don't feel bad if you feel like you wanna say no to me." Because that's her advocating for herself, right? That she's uncomfortable. But I also felt like I was advocating for myself in that I was saying, "listen, I need a ride." And, and ultimately the answer was no. And so I went back and called another Uber and eventually I was able to get back, but I missed the end of the race. But even though I got a no, I was like, you know what, I did something courageous today. I asked somebody for a ride that I never would have done that in the past. And even though it was a no, I already didn't have a ride. And now I still didn't have a ride. Right? So going right along with what you said, I got a no. But at the same time, my self respect took a little bit of a spike because I was like, "look at me. I couraged up and I did something scary."

Samantha Nielsen 33:27

You did. And I love that you point out, "I already didn't have a ride." So by asking, I was losing nothing. But by asking, you could have secured a yes. And in this case, it was a no. And that's fine. That's fine. You're a grown up. You could handle that and not feel shattered, but you already didn't have it. So,you know, by stepping into that space and making the request, you opened the door for the opportunity.

Tanya Hale 33:50

Yeah. Yeah. All right. Advocating for yourself. Okay. Samantha, you have a course on advocating that you offer, right? Will you tell everybody about that and where to find you and stuff?

Samantha Nielsen 34:01

Absolutely. Thank you. Advocating is one of my superpowers. I absolutely love advocating when all these elements come into place and it's done in the correct way. And it's a skill that I've had to work hard to refine. And so I love sharing what I've learned with others. And the best way to reach me, if you want to learn more about this is to visit my website, which is moderndaydivorce.com. And I currently do have a free training with a worksheet. It's called "advocate like an expert." So sign up for that. You're going to get this mini training and this introspective worksheet that's going to help you assess how you're doing in this space in your life. And then I do offer a more detailed course if people are interested in and learning more, but that's available through my website at moderndaydivorce.com. And I also talk a lot about this particular skill through my Instagram account, which is modern.day.divorce. So those are the best ways for people to learn more and to connect with me and also to, you know, really figure out how they're handling life if they are in the space of looking at divorce and divorce or beyond divorce.

Tanya Hale 35:11

Mm-hmm, good stuff. Samantha, I'm so glad you came today to talk about advocating because this is just something that as women, the more we learn to do this, the better off we're going to be and when we're better off, so are all the people in our lives.

Samantha Nielsen 35:30

Absolutely, 100%. Thank you for having me, Tanya. I absolutely loved our conversation.

Tanya Hale 35:35

Well, I do too. I always love when we get together. So by the way, Samantha and I just found out yesterday when we were chatting. We've been chatting for about six months or so, just found out yesterday that we both grew up in the same small town. And she was a, she wasn't there as long as I was, but, um, and she was after I was. So she was the age of one of my younger sisters, but I was like, what? Shelly, Idaho.

Samantha Nielsen 35:58

Shelly, Idaho. I love Shelly, Idaho. Big shout out for Shelly.

Tanya Hale 36:02

I know, right? The Shelly Russets. By the way, our high school mascot was a russet potato. How awesome is that?

Samantha Nielsen 36:08

I know, but it couldn't be more fitting. That's exactly what Shelly was all about. And, you know, good potatoes and all those terrific things that bring us together.

Tanya Hale 36:18

Yep. Absolutely. All right, Samantha. Thank you so much. Alright, my friends, that is going to do it. Advocating is part of growing up. This is what we do when we grow up in the middle age is we learn to advocate for ourselves and we learn to ask with courage and with confidence and with kindness. Okay. That's going to do it. Have an awesome, awesome week and we'll see you next time. Bye.

Tanya Hale 36:38

Thank you so much for joining me today. If you would love to receive some weekend motivation, be sure to sign up for my free "weekend win" Friday email: a short and quick message to help you have a better weekend and position yourself for a more productive week. Go to tanyahale.com to sign up and learn more about life coaching and how it can help you get to your best self ever. See ya.